So Many Questions: Julius Malema on land occupation

21 December 2014 - 16:58 By Chris Barron
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Julius Malema. File photo.
Julius Malema. File photo.
Image: Supplied

Newly re-elected president of the Economic Freedom Fighters Julius Malema has ordered his followers to occupy land and mines. Chris Barron asked him . . .

Why are you telling people to break the law?

I have never asked anyone to break the law.

Aren't land grabs illegal?

I've never spoken about land grabs, I've spoken about land occupation.

What's the difference?

Land grab is when people go and forcefully remove others from occupied land. We're not talking about that. We're saying there is too much abandoned land in South Africa, some owned by foreigners who don't even know what that land looks like, and some by the government. So we are saying to our people it is time to start occupying the unoccupied land.

Isn't it illegal to occupy land that doesn't belong to you?

Let that be tested in court.

How's it going to help homeless people if the police keep knocking their structures down?

They must never lose patience, they must continue to build until the police get tired.

Who's going to pay their costs?

The people will be paying for themselves. This is a struggle. Somebody has to pay.

Will you reimburse them?

I am not going to reimburse anybody, no one gets reimbursed in a struggle. Stop prioritising money. This is a struggle about the land. It is not about reimbursement. Not everything is about money, brother.

It is for people who don't have any.

They don't mind. They know there is a price to be paid in a struggle and they are prepared to pay that heavy price.

Aren't you giving them false hope?

There is no false hope in land occupation.

You know they're not going to be allowed to stay on the land they occupy.

They will stay. With their determination to occupy the land, no one will defeat the people. The state will not defeat the people. Not even the police will defeat the people. The unity of the people will make them rise above any difficulty.

Isn't that just empty rhetoric?

That's what your forebears said about the struggle during apartheid. They thought there would never be democracy, they thought the black man would never vote.

As an MP, aren't you obliged to uphold the law?

I uphold the law.

You're telling people to break the law.

I'm telling people to take what rightfully belongs to them. I was elected for these people. In case you were in Europe during [the] elections, let me remind you what I said: "Vote for us, we'll lead a struggle to expropriate the land without compensation." We're doing that.

Which is against the constitution and therefore illegal, isn't it?

It is not against the revolution.

Does revolution come first for you or the constitution?

The revolution comes first.

Do you accept the constitution?

I'm living under the constitution.

Aren't you deliberately flouting it?

I am challenging the constitution in a democratic South Africa and I am allowed to do so.

Why do you keep calling for revolution when people are free to vote for your policies if they want them?

My brother, the people will decide what they want. We have made a call and that call says the people will vote for the land. And they are not going to vote through some cross, they are going to vote through the occupation of the land.

So the vote means nothing?

No, no, we are all beneficiaries of that. I'm saying the vote does not end with a cross. It must be translated into action.

Through revolution?

The revolution is part of democracy.

Isn't the whole point of democracy that it makes revolution unnecessary?

No, revolution is radical change. Democracy is the right to protest. Democracy is not limited to the vote. This is a protest allowed by the constitution.

But you're calling for it to be flouted.

I'm not calling for any constitution to be flouted.

Expropriation without compensation is not constitutional.

We are protesting through the occupation of the land. Protest is not unconstitutional.

What about the jobs that will be lost when you close the mines?

I've told you we all have to pay a price.

You're happy for others to pay a price but you yourself don't pay a price?

I'm paying a price. I am part of this revolution, I am a victim of political onslaught. I'm leading from the front, I am not just talking.

But you're not going to lose your job?

If it means losing a job, let me lose it. I don't care about losing any job.

Because you've got private backers?

I'm prepared to lose my life, don't tell me about a job.

You can say that because you've got private backers.

I'm prepared to lose my life. No private backer can give me a life.

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